Wednesday, March 24, 2021

"China Doesn’t Respect Us Anymore — for Good Reason"

"At last week’s Alaska meeting between America’s and China’s top diplomats, Chinese officials made it quite clear that they no longer fear our criticism, because they don’t respect us as they once did, and they don’t think the rest of the world does, either. Or as Yang Jiechi, China’s top foreign affairs policymaker, baldly told his U.S. counterparts: “The United States does not have the qualification...to speak to China from a position of strength.”

"Surprised? What did you think, that the Chinese didn’t notice that our last president inspired his followers to ransack our Capitol, that a majority of his party did not recognize the results of our democratic election, that a member of our Congress believes that Jewish-run space lasers cause forest fires, that left-wing anarchists were allowed to take over a section of downtown Portland, creating havoc for months, that during the pandemic the U.S. printed money to help its consumers keep spending — much of it on Chinese-made goods — while China printed money to invest in even more infrastructure, and that gun violence in America is out control?"

-- Thomas Friedman, "China Doesn’t Respect Us Anymore — for Good Reason," New York Times, 3/23/21

26 comments:

Entropic man said...

I'm inclined to agree with Me Friedman.

China has the world's largest population, 1.4 billion compared to the US 340 million.

China has the greatest military strength.

https://m.economictimes.com/news/defence/china-beats-us-in-ultimate-military-strength-index-while-india-comes-in-fourth/india/slideshow/81632453.cms

China's economic strength is second only to the US, is expanding faster than the US, and due to become strongest by 2028.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-55454146

While the US retreated into "America First" isolationism China has expanded its trade, aid, influence and soft power into the gap the US left. With that comes voting support in international organisations such as the UN.

By at least two measures China is already top dog. By the rest, they soon will be.

China is even more focused on self-interest than the US and has 3000 years more experience at the game of power. Why should they respect a weaker opponent?

David in Cal said...

China now doesn't respect the US, and that's supposed to be Trump's fault. Give me a break. China didn't stop respecting the US during the entire 1,461 days that Trump was President. Their lack of respect happened after Biden was President. It's on him.

Cheers

Entropic man said...

David in Cal

Trump was an opportunity for China. They told him what he wanted to hear while expanding their interests into the global space his "America First" isolationism left vacant.

Biden is a different animal, less easily fooled by flattery. Hence China's more direct approach to the new POTUS.

Layzej said...

Hi DiC,

What is China referring to when they say:

“We believe that it is important for the United States to change its own image and to stop advancing its own democracy in the rest of the world. Many people within the United States actually have little confidence in the democracy of the United States.”

Clearly Trump is responsible for the rejection of democracy in the USA. Under Trump, 106 republican members of congress and 18 state attorney generals asked the supreme court to overturn the national election and preference an historically unpopular incumbent. A natural consequence of the rhetoric that Trump spread even before he was elected.

The USA has lost all credibility in its efforts to export democracy.

Yang said: “China will not accept unwarranted accusations from the US side,” adding that recent developments had plunged relations “into a period of unprecedented difficulty” that “has damaged the interests of our two peoples”.

Was he possibly referring to something Biden had done in the last month? Can you highlight one of those recent developments?

Yang said: “We hope that United States will do better on human rights. The fact is that there are many problems within the United States regarding human rights, which is admitted by the US itself,”

This certainly didn't start with Trump, but there's no doubt that things blew up under Trump. A direct reaction to his pandering to neo-nazis and the KKK.

David in Cal said...

EM - Interestingly enough, conservatives say the exact opposite. Conservatives say Trump did an exceptional job of resisting China, and Biden will more kowtow to them. I wonder how one could objectively verify which President is more resistant to Chinese aggression and expansion.

Cheers

David in Cal said...

Layzej - Human rights in the US are probably better protected than in any other country. (Of course, one can always find a few examples showing that we have not achieved perfection.) In international terms, the US has reason to be proud of its human rights situation. Trump expressed pride in the US

Biden and Democrats gave China an opening by wildly exaggerating a few US human rights flaws and by characterizing the US as a major human rights violator. They also wildly exaggerated and flat-out lied about Donald Trump's supposed opposition to human rights. It was easy for China to brand the US as a human rights violator. All they had to do was to quote Pres. Biden.

Cheers

David in Cal said...

This could be the eventual solution to greenhouse gas emissions.

https://thenextweb.com/neural/2021/03/23/scientists-will-test-the-worlds-first-nuclear-fusion-reactor-this-summer/

Hopefully...

Thomas said...

DiC, according to this list USA is number 18 in human rights.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/the-10-countries-that-care-the-most-about-human-rights-according-to-perception
Americans tend to have a very biased opinion of their own country compared to others. You don't get to be number one in fraction of population in prison by being too careful about human rights.

David in Cal said...

Thomas - thanks for the link. The article says USA is #18 in CARING ABOUT human rights, whatever that means.

It also depends on WHICH rights are given greater weight. The writers of our Constitution considered the Right to Bear Arms to be an important human right.

Layzej said...

DiC: It was easy for China to brand the US as a human rights violator. All they had to do was to quote Pres. Biden.

They didn't quote Biden. They referenced current events. Events that largely Biden's run for office.

Layzej said...

according to this list USA is number 18 in human rights

There's no comparison between China and USA. USA wins hands down on human rights.

Here's a report by the Fraser institute (a conservative think tank) that ranks freedom based on the following criteria:

• Rule of Law
• Security and Safety
• Movement
• Religion
• Association, Assembly, and Civil Society
• Expression and Information
• Identity and Relationships
• Size of Government
• Legal System and Property Rights
• Access to Sound Money
• Freedom to Trade Internationally
• Regulation of Credit, Labor, and Business

It places USA and UK as tied at #17, and China at 129.

But the cases China raised are real. USA lost all credibility under Trump to promote democracy around the world. A large portion of the USA doubts they even have a democracy. They believe the elections are rigged. DiC may be among them. With gerrymandering, voter suppression, and backdoor calls to pressure election investigators to "find us 11017 votes", maybe they're not entirely wrong.

J. D. said...

Their lack of respect happened after Biden was President. It's on him.

You may disagree with Biden's policies, I certainly don't agree with all he has done, but to suggest any lack of respect is down to him is risible. Trump spent weeks lying about the election result and tried to stop votes against him being counted and when that failed he tried to get them disallowed. His actions eventually resulted in a violent insurrection. That put America on an equal footing to a Banana Republic. What has Biden done that compares to that?

David in Cal said...

Off topic: David was mentioned in Mark Steyn's testimony in the Michael Mann lawsuit. In discovery, Steyn said:

IF YOU WANT THE HARDCORE SEXUAL REFERENCES, INDEED BEFORE MONICA, YOU CAN GO TO DAVID APPELL, DAVID APPELL, A-P-P-E-L-L. ANOTHER ASSOCIATE OF MANN’S WHO SAID THAT IN THIS BUSINESS, ACCUSED JOHN HINDERAKER, A DEFENDER OF MINE OF FELLATING THE KOCH BROTHERS — ALL THE KOCH BROTHERS, I BELIEVE. I’M NOT SURE HOW MANY OF THEM THERE ARE. I DON’T KNOW WHETHER THEY’RE AS NUMEROUS AS MARX BROTHERS BUT THAT’S A LOT OF FELLATING. AND THAT WAS DAVID APPELL’S THING.

https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2021/03/mark-steyn-testifies.php

Cheers

JoeT said...

This could be the eventual solution to greenhouse gas emissions.
https://thenextweb.com/neural/2021/03/23/scientists-will-test-the-worlds-first-nuclear-fusion-reactor-this-summer/


Some of the worst science writing I've seen. This is not the world's first nuclear fusion reactor. In fact JET did these exact same experiments back in 1997 and reached a Q = output power/input power of 0.67. It's not even clear JET will do as well this summer. "Fusion is hard" the article says. No kidding. "ITER could change everything" Maybe. Or it could disrupt and damage the first wall. Or burn out the expensive tiles than line the outside of the machine. "Machine learning systems and artificial intelligence models (power) the system to scale fusion systems" What garbage. The frontier is understanding and controlling 3D turbulence. AI is no substitute for physics.

CO2 needs to come down now and fast. It can't wait another 40 years for a fusion reactor to be tied to the grid.

The writers of our Constitution considered the Right to Bear Arms to be an important human right.

They didn't. This was Madison's concession to Patrick Henry so that state militias could arm white citizens to put down slave revolts. And it allowed Virginia to ratify the Bill of Rights.

David was mentioned in Mark Steyn's testimony in the Michael Mann lawsuit

Disgusting. Why would you even think of posting this trash on this blog?

Thomas said...

Layzej, "There's no comparison between China and USA. USA wins hands down on human rights. "

Obviously, if you lower the bar far enough USA come out ahead, but DiC's claim was that USA was number one. Also Trump didn't invent gerrymandering or voter suppression. Trump just made already existing flaws in USA democracy more visible, and made it more acceptable to talk about them.

Entropic man said...

David in Cal said...

"EM - Interestingly enough, conservatives say the exact opposite. "

I'm afraid I've become cynical about what conservatives say.

For example, this has become a regular outcome of the conservative low regulation approach.

A mining company sets up a mine and commits to clean up afterwards.

When the mine starts to run down the company is asset stripped.

When the mine closes, all that is left of the company is a bankrupt shell which cannot pay for the cleanup.

One example:-

https://mustelid.blogspot.com/2021/03/a-bankruptcy-judge-lets-blackjewel-shed.html

David in Cal said...

Joe T - One reason I posted that quote was in hopes of learning whether David A had actually said the things Mark Steyn imputed to him.

Cheers

Entropic man said...

Whatever was said, Steyn's rhetorical argument is a familiar justification.

"He said something bad, so it's all right for me to say something bad."



Entropic man said...

Speaking of voter supression.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56526116

Layzej said...

In Canada, you can vote if someone will vouch for your identity and address, or you can provide evidence of address and identity. Library or student card, or even personal cheque are acceptable forms of ID.

Penalty for fraud is up to $50,000 fine and up to five years in jail. That's generally enough to keep people honest.

The right to vote is protected under our charter of rights and freedoms. American's do not enjoy this right. There are many American citizens who are simply not eligible to vote. The measures outlined in EM's BBC article will certainly mean that some folks who are eligible will nonetheless be prohibited from voting.

David in Cal said...

There are many American citizens who are simply not eligible to vote.

Which American citizens are not eligible to vote?

Cheers

Layzej said...

Some people with felony convictions. Rules vary by state.
U.S. citizens residing in U.S. territories
For senate and house representation, citizens residing in DC.

JoeT said...

One reason I posted that quote was in hopes of learning whether David A had actually said the things Mark Steyn imputed to him

I could care less whether Hinderaker uses knee pads or not. This is pretty classic deflection meant to divert attention from policy solutions to limit CO2 emission. It's disgusting that you even brought it here. David shouldn't have to address this form of mindless vilification.

You should take your post down.

Layzej said...

Anyone remember Bastardi's wager from 2011? He bet there would be 0.1C - 0.2C cooling by 2021. It seems he owes Zeke Hausfather a few steak dinners: https://twitter.com/hausfath/status/1356324992980373504

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